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Unable to align staves horizontally across 2 or more pages

PostPosted: Mon Jul 09, 2018 4:08 pm
by puddlejumper60

I actually have 3 main questions regarding what I guess in past Sibelius versions (Sib 5, at least - the one I'm most familiar with), would either be automatic or adjusted via Engraving Rules. I'm currently using version 2018.5 and, as far as I can see, there doesn't appear to be an Engraving Rules menu any more. There's a few things I'm having bother with:

1. Aligning staves across 2 or more pages
Sib 5 would do this automatically, and I find it hard to believe that in newer versions the same isn't also true. It looks like it's possibly a margin setting issue - obviously the first page of a score allows space for a title and therefore the first stave is positioned to accommodate that, which is fine (although a little annoying as Sib 5 would allow you add a title and adjust stave positioning simply by selecting and dragging). Whilst you can also select and drag in 2018.5 you appear to be restrained by preset margins, so can't therefore drag staves above a certain height. Frustrating. But even more annoying is when you have at least 2 pages in a part, the staves on the second page refuse to align with those on the 1st page, no matter how much you drag them about trying to achieve this. It looks like the bottom page margin is set lower than the 1st page and no amount of dragging staves about makes any difference, they remain out of alignment.

Is there (I hope) an easy workaround for this?

2. Page numering and bar numbering
Is there a way to specify font and positioning for these? Again, something that was easily adjusted in Engraving Rules in Sib 5 but now appears discontinued.

3. Grace note positioning
Also something that was automatic in Sib 5 (beginning to wish I still had it!). In 2018.5 if you just select a grace note and try to place it in front of a note, it leaves too much space between the grace note and main note. However, if you select the note first then place the grace note it's generally closer and better visually. Can live with that so far. The problem I've had recently is when placing a grace note in voice 2 and there's a rest directly above in voice 1, the rest moves to align with the grace note which is definitely not correct. I should add that I'm writing drum set charts, so voice 1 would usually be hi hat/cymbals etc and voice 2 snare, toms and bass. Any ideas how to avoid the rest in voice 1 moving to align with the grace note instead of staying in postion above the main note?

Thanks very much in advance for any help.

Re: Unable to align staves horizontally across 2 or more pag

PostPosted: Mon Jul 09, 2018 7:19 pm
by andyg
Are you using the latest version of Sibelius, now known as 'Ultimate', or are you using the version formerly known as Sibelius First that's now known simply as Sibelius, or are you using the free, completely stripped down version now known as Sibelius First?

In Ultimate, you'll find Engraving Rules in the Ribbon.

Page numbering and positioning are also there in Engraving Rules.

Not sure about the grace note issues, but they should be adjustable in Ultimate.

Sound like you're running one of the lesser versions which won't have all the functionality you're used to.

Confused by all the renaming? You and everyone else, especially customers who have inadvertently bought or installed the wrong version. It was a stupid move by Avid and one that will cost them dearly in the long run, I'm sure. Plenty of discussion on the official Sibelius Forum, rather than here.

Re: Unable to align staves horizontally across 2 or more pag

PostPosted: Mon Jul 09, 2018 9:04 pm
by puddlejumper60
Hi, thanks for the reply. I'm grateful. The version I'm using is, I think, Sibelius First. I thought that was supposed to be equal to previous versions of Sibelius and that Ultimate was more for serious professional orchestrators with enhanced functionality for power users - not something I need, or so I thought. Now I'm definitely confused, perhaps I've actually got the stripped down version. Can you tell from the version number? Mine is 2018.5 build 1755. Think I'll need to check on the Avid website.

Sounds from what you're saying that I do actually need the functionality of Ultimate - seems overkill, though, for what should be straitghtforward settings issues.

Ha, I thought this was the official Sibelius forum! Is there a link to official one somewhere? I'll have a look. Thanks again for your help. Much appreciated.

Re: Unable to align staves horizontally across 2 or more pag

PostPosted: Tue Jul 10, 2018 7:02 am
by andyg
This forum is where many of the 'owners' of cracked versions of Sibelius used to lurk years ago. Now it's a ghost town! ... ?groupid=3 is the official 'chat page', as it's called.

The old Sibelius First (now just Sibelius) was always a very low powered affair, and the new free Sibelius First is so weedy that I'm recommending my students to go for Musescore instead. I've heard it referred to as 'Sibelius Worst'! :)

You need the full monty, ie Ultimate. Overkill? Yes, but it's the only way to get what you need.

Much discussion of all of this on the official forum.

Re: Unable to align staves horizontally across 2 or more pag

PostPosted: Tue Jul 10, 2018 3:50 pm
by puddlejumper60
Thanks, Andy. Can't say I like the format of the chat forum much, prefer the messageboard format like this. Is this place still just about alive and worth sticking around and posting to, or is it better to post on the chat page?

I've decided to upgrade to Sibelius Ultimate in the hope that'll solve the issues I mentioned above and provide a greater level of customisability.

Thanks again for your help.

Re: Unable to align staves horizontally across 2 or more pag

PostPosted: Tue Jul 10, 2018 9:34 pm
by MikeLyons
FWIW, I never thought Sib first a good idea. There is too much 'everyday stuff' missing for it to be worth the money.
The renaimng exercise Avid has just undergone has caused so much confusion and anger amongst users old and new that it almost seems like Avid are trying to damage Sibelius.
Glad you are getting the full version. It is definitely worth the money on usability alone.