Hairpin diminuendo property not saved to score

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yimtland
Posts: 3
Joined: Sat Sep 25, 2021 4:41 pm
Sibelius Version: 10
Operating System: Windows

Post by yimtland » Sun Sep 26, 2021 2:58 pm

Hello. I'm using a hairpin diminuendo in my score for a dozen or so instruments at the end of a bar. I select one of the hairpin instances and launch the Inspector panel. I then adjust the playback option using the drop-down list from the default of "auto" to "change" by percentage (the default percentage change is 10%). I'm using NotePerformer for my playback configuration.

After making this same change to all of the hairpins, the playback is exactly as I expect it to be. However, when I then save the changes to the score, and then either close the score and re-open it, or recycle Sibelius and then re-open the score, the playback configuration for these hairpins reverts back to "auto", the default setting. For some reason, Sibelius is not "remembering" the change I made to the hairpin configuration via the Inspector panel after saving the score. This feels like a program bug and not a user error, but wanted to see if anyone else on this forum has observed this problem. I suppose I could look into authoring a command macro to make these same changes via the Inspector each time the score is re-opened, but that would clearly be a workaround, not a solution.

Thank you in advance for any constructive feedback.

Sibelius Ultimate, v2021.2
Windows 10 Pro, 32 cores, 128GB


MikeLyons
Posts: 1631
Joined: Fri Jun 24, 2016 7:20 pm
Sibelius Version: Ult. 2024.3.1/7.5
Operating System: Windows

Post by MikeLyons » Sun Sep 26, 2021 3:01 pm

I can't say I'm surprised. The developers have been too busy futzing around with 'toys' to spend any time fixing real bugs.

I've just tried this and it doesn't happen for me. The changes still stay even after a complete shutdown and restart.
Sib 6.2, 7.5 and 2023.6, Windows 11, 32GB RAM, 16TB 7200RPM Storage, 2TB SSD, Note Performer 3.3.2, EWQLSO, EWQLSC, Harmony Assistant and some others. mike@mike-lyons.co.uk

yimtland
Posts: 3
Joined: Sat Sep 25, 2021 4:41 pm
Sibelius Version: 10
Operating System: Windows

Post by yimtland » Sun Sep 26, 2021 4:42 pm

Mike, thank you for your response. I don't know if it makes any difference, but the hairpins I'm changing via the Inspector follow a 'ppp' dynamic marking (left-side of the hairpin), but have no target dynamic at the end of the hairpin. The goal is too reduce the dynamic in the bar to silence (niente). Unfortunately, NotePerformer does not appear to recognize the 'n' or 'N' at the end of the hairpin, which would normally denote niente to the performer / conductor. This is why I used the Inspector to adjust the properties (which, again, works great until the score is closed and later re-opened).

Thanks again.
Tim

Sibelius, v2021.2, NotePerformer 3.3.2
Windows 10 Pro, 32 cores, 128GB

MikeLyons
Posts: 1631
Joined: Fri Jun 24, 2016 7:20 pm
Sibelius Version: Ult. 2024.3.1/7.5
Operating System: Windows

Post by MikeLyons » Sun Sep 26, 2021 6:23 pm

MIDI data is severely limited (at least in Sibelius) with regard to the settings for dynamics. There are 127 different numbers for dynamics, and Sib's table looks like this:

fff - 127
ff - 113
f - 98
mf - 84
mp - 71
p - 61
pp - 39
ppp - 20

As you can see, it's not a logical set of numbers and it's not even.

You can define a word niente to set the volume to 0 in the dictionary. See image.

A dim. line will follow that. You can enter the word in practically any text style. (Obvs. expression is best). The "to nothing" lines don't work, because you can't actually set a line to do that.

Hope this helps.
niente.png
niente.png (37.34 KiB) Viewed 1555 times
Sib 6.2, 7.5 and 2023.6, Windows 11, 32GB RAM, 16TB 7200RPM Storage, 2TB SSD, Note Performer 3.3.2, EWQLSO, EWQLSC, Harmony Assistant and some others. mike@mike-lyons.co.uk

yimtland
Posts: 3
Joined: Sat Sep 25, 2021 4:41 pm
Sibelius Version: 10
Operating System: Windows

Post by yimtland » Sun Sep 26, 2021 8:34 pm

Hi Mike. Your suggestion of adding niente to the performance dictionary had mixed results. For most of the instruments in the score, the result was as expected, so I was quite encouraged. However, some of the instruments (in particular, the woodwinds and 1st violins) seemed to ignore the notation, and even resulted in a slight increase in dynamic volume towards the end of the bar (when the sound should be decreasing to inaudible).

I then went back and played around a bit more with the original hairpins and the Inspector panel. What I found is that if you modify the Change percentage value from the default of 10 to, let's say, 11 (any value other than 10), then the new value is preserved in the score after saving. But, as soon as I change the value back to the original default of 10, the setting went back to "auto" after saving, and the desired effect was never achieved. The different between 10 and 11 percent is virtually undetectable, so I made the same change across the board to all the instrument hairpins in the bar, and my end-goal was finally achieved. I closed and re-opened Sibelius numerous times just to convince myself that the new value did indeed "stick".

Thank you very much for your assistance.

Regards,
Tim

Sibelius Ultimate, v2021.2; NotePerformer 3.3.2
Windows 10 Pro, 32 cores, 128GB

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